9 Feb 1673? Attestation- applicant

Op huyden desen 14e February XVIC drie ende
tseventrich compareerden voor mij Johannes
Ranck, openbaer notaris, bij den Hove van Hollandt
geadmitteert, binnen der stad Delft residerende,
in presentie van de ondergeschreven getuygen,
Anna Jans, huysvrouwe van
Wouters Stoffelsz Bernart, woonende alhier,
dewelcke verclaerde ende attesteerde
ten versoucke van Elisabeth Jans Klinck,
huysvrouwe van Joost Pauwelsz den Berch,
meede alhier woonachtich, waeracht-
tich te weesen, dat eene Maria Frans,
huysvrouwe van Jan Abramsz Bleyswijck
tegen haer attestante geseyt heeft,
dat een man (sonder de naem te noemen)
die naer OostIndie vaeren soude ende
gevaren is, seyde dat Elisabeth
de Berch(requirante in desen) soude
sijn de hoer van Jan Abramsz
Bleyswijck voorn., Hijnnercik Fransz Cool
ende sij Maria Franssen ende Joost de Berch
besteecken heeft dat hij niet licht
weeder in Holland sal comen, eyndigende
hiermeede haeren depositie met pre-
sentatie t'geene voorsz. staet des noot
ende mede versocht sijnde met eede
te willen bevestigen, consenteerende
hiervan acte in forma gemaeckt ende
gelevert te werden. Aldus verleeden
ende gepasseert binnen dese stadt, in
presentie van Jochem ende Frans Fransz
Boogaert notarisclercquen als getuygen
van gelove ten desen versocht ten dage
voorsz.
Dit merck X is gestelt bij de voorn. Anna Jans
Dese letters  man sijn gestelt bij den
voorn. Maria Adriaens
F. Bogert
J. Bogert
Johannis Ranck notaris 1673

This is a deed made up because of possible reputation damage; putting such a quarrel in writing was not uncommon in those times. Disclaimer: the text may be unsuitable for young readers or sensitive minds ;)

On the 14th of February 1673 appeared before notary Johannes Ranek and witnesses present
Anna Jans, wife of Wouter Stoffelsz Bernart; Anna was living in Delft. At the request of Elisabeth Jans Klinck, wife of Joost Pouwelsz de Berch, also living in Delft, Anna stated that a certain Maria Frans, wife of Jan Abrams Bleijswijck, had said to her that a certain man 'without mentioning the name of that man' bound to travel to the East Indies and who had sailed off to the East Indies had named Elisabeth 'the whore of Jan Abramsz Bleijswijck' and that Maria Frans subsequently reportedly had stated that Joost de Berch was not likely to return home any time soon. The note in the left margin below states that also appeared Maris Adriaens van der Sloot, aged 22, who also stated to have heard Maria Frans cursing at Elisabeth, calling Elsiabeth a whore.

Dear Geert and Rene

O'h my goodness- that's not what I was expecting!

Poor Elisabeth. She was running (and was the potter having passed the Guild masters test) the Drie Porcelyene Flessies in Delft between 1671-1675 whilst her husband Joost Berch was sailing away - I assume for the VOC, so you can see why she would defend herself from the slander.

I would love to know what the outcome is, so I'll post the next 2 documents; 15? February and 9 March 1673 to see how the saga ends.

with grateful thanks to you both

Anne

March 1673 document

Op huyden desen 15en February XVIC drie ende
tseventich compareerden voor mij Johannes
Ranck, openbaer notaris, bij den Hove van Holland
geadmitteert, binnen  der stad Delft residerende,
in presentie van de ondergeschreven getuygen, Anna
Jans, huysvrouwe van Wouter Stoffelsz
Bernart, woonende alhier, dewelcke
verclaerde ende attesteerde ten versoucke
van Elisabeth Jan Klinck, huysvrou van
Joost Pouwels de Berch, meede woonende
alhier, waerachtich te weesen, dat eenen
Maria Frans, huysvrouwe van Jan Abramsz
Bleyswijck, tegen haer attestante geseyt
heeft, dat sij tegens seecker persoon, varende
naer Oost Indie (sonder de name te weten)
geseght hadde, dat Lijsbeth Jans Klinck
requirante in desen, was de hoer van Jan Abramsz
Bleyswijck voorn., ende dat sij denselven
wel belast hadden, alsoo hij naer de
voorn. Joost de Berch toevoer, dat hij  sulcx hem
de Berch seer wel soude seggen, ende
sij Maria Frans soo wel hadden besteecken
dat hij Joost de Berch niet licht weeder
in Holland sal comen, compareer-
de mede voor mij notaris voorn. ende de
getuygen naergenoemt, Maria Ariaens van der
Sloot, out 22 jaeren, die verclaerde nevens
de voorn. attestante Anna Jans meede gehoort
te hebben dat Maria Frans voorn. tegen
haer requirante met scheltwoorden seyde,
dat sij requirante een hoer was ende oock dat
sij Maria Fransz over straet, ja de Pieterstraet
deurgeroupen heeft dat de requirante een hoer was,
eyndigende hiermeede haere depositie, met presentatie
t'geene voorsz. is, des noot ende naeder
versocht sijnde, met eede te willen bevestigen,
consenterende etc. Aldus verleeden ende gepasseert
binnen deser stad, in presentie van Frans
Frans ende Joachianius Boogart, notarisclercquen
hiertoe versocht.
Dit merck is gestelt X bij de voorn. Anna Jans
F. Bogert, J. Bogert
Johannes Ranck, notaris, 1673

Hi Anne,

The second document, from 15 February 1673, has in fact the same content as the first one, now having all corrections and additions processed into the main text. The only addition is that the last witness mentioned that Maria Frans called out the accusations on Elisabeth in the Pieterstraat in Delft.

The third document, dated 8 March 1673, reveals the background of this quarrel. The document is a statement by Michiel Marissen, a carpenter specialised in working with ebony (ebbenhoutwerker), his wife Annetgen Marinis, and Willemijntgen Jans, the latter being a seemstress of wolen clothes (wollenaaister). The first two witnesses stated at the request of Elisabeth that about a year ago Maria Frans, who appears to be the wife of Jan Abrams Bleijswijck, started living in with them, apparently separate from her husband, and stayed with them for about 3/4 of a year. During her stay, Maria Frans repeatedly called Elisabeth 'the whore of Jan Abrams Bleijswijck'  (husband of Maria!) to whomever would listen to her and also claimed that Elisabeth would have become pregnant with Jan Abrams Bleijswijcks' child and should show signs of pregnancy or give birth soon. Also, according to the witnesses, Maria repeatedly pointed out she won a case against her husband before the local authorities, and that her husband had to pay her 2,5 guilders (rijksdaalder) every week. The witnesses stated they knew all this because Maria also repeated her accusations at the home  of the first two witnesses, the third witness also being present there.

Hi Geert & Rene

It sounds to me like Maria Frans was a very difficult, quarrelsome woman!

Thank you both for adding to the information; not quite what I expected to find out about Elisabeth but colourful non-the-less.

I greatly appreciate your efforts on my behalf.

very best wishes

Anne

I've found a very short entry for Elisabeth Klinck and Joost Bergh in 1680 in the Orphan chamber.

Do they have any children or is there any other information?

Thanks

Anne

No children mentioned. Transcription and translation combined:

Joost de Bergh

On 8 December 1680 has been shown at the Orphans' Chamber
the will drawn up by Joost de Berch
and Elisabeth Jans de Clinck, and passed on 29 April 1669
before notary Jacobus van Berlicum
and witnesses, within this city
and put into effect by the death of the aforementioned Elisabeth Jans Clinck,
in which will was found
the Orphans' Chamber to be excluded.
Done in the presence of all governors of the Orphans' Chamber.

That's great, thanks Rene.

Can we assume that Joost and Elisabeth married in 1669 do you think?

Do you by any chance know where you can find the wills for this period? I feel so much information could be gained from the wills many of the pottery owners/managers made, but so far I haven't been able to find where they are held.

very best wishes

Anne

Hi Anne, they put their banns (ondertrouw) on 22 September 1668 and married on 10 October 1668  in Delft

Joost Pouwelsen de Berch jongeman aende Oude Delft
Lijsbeth Jans Clincke weduwe van Pouwels Heyn-
dricxsen van Sickenburch mede aldaar

Marge:
Getrouwt den 10 october
1668

Joost Pouwelsen de Berch young men [i.e. he was never married before], livingv at the Oude Delft
Lijsbeth Jans Clincke widow of Pouwels Heyn-
dricxsen van Sickenburch, also living there

Margin:
Married on 10 October
1668

The wills are in the archives of the notaries. Easiest to find via Search page (https://zoeken.stadsarchiefdelft.nl/zoeken.php?overzicht=alles) on [Personen] and filter the results on [Notariële akte]

Hi Rene

Many thanks for the information and the attachment.

I had found Elisabeth Klincke's first marriage but had dismissed it as not being her because I didn't realise Joost was her second husband. I'd failed to spot this second marriage.

My problem is that I search the Delft archives website in English- which is a fantastic facility but sometimes things get lost in translation and although I tick 'similar' for names it's possible to miss entries due to a small variation in spellings. Sometimes the results are quite amusing. I've seen Isaac referred to as 'ice cream'!

I'll try out the link you suggested for wills using the notary filter. I hadn't noticed that before.

happy weekend.

Anne